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20 Comments on "Rape in the Great Sept of Baelor: An Analysis"

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Joe
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Rape sequences in movies has been taboo for decades. In my view, the more offensive parts of Game of Thrones goes way beyond the pale of good judgment for TV programming. HBO likes to say its “unlike anything else that has ever been tried on television.” That must include the scenes of graphic (and audible) homosexuality. Full frontal nudity of both genders is bad enough, but it’s not the worst part. The entertainment industry, now including TV that goes directly into everybody’s homes, is pushing the envelope too far when it shows sexual acts between two men and, as in… Read more »
Cian Gaffney
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Well, it just so happens that homosexuality is completely natural and a part of life, and you should get used to it.

Cian Gaffney
Guest
I’m not going to get into much detail on this topic (since by merit of being male I will potentially be attacked by some people), but we must always take into account the time period Game of Thrones is emulating. As deplorable as some of the acts of characters in the show may seem to us from a modern perspective, a lot can change when perceived from a medieval perspective. Whatever the intentions of the producers and director, what was presented to us onscreen was undoubtedly more in line with rape than not. In the book, it’s more nuanced, and… Read more »
Rochelle
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It was consent in the book because…why? Because after Jaime made it clear by ripping her underwear and physically separating her legs that she wasn’t being given any choice in the matter, she gave in and enthusiastically participated? Just because she gave in, just because she forgave him, does not change the fact that what he did was rape. It means that the situation is complex – and that GRRM’s rape scene was more nuanced and thought-provoking than HBO’s.

Ashton
Guest

Get off your bullshit feminazi fucking pedestal. She was saying no because of the location- and her feeble fists aren’t weak and ‘womanly’ it’s because she WANTS to have sex with Jaime- just not here, she changes her mind about the LOCATION of the place because of his willingness, kinda like if you ask your friend where to eat lunch? She wanted it just as bad in the books, and it was consensual. That doesn’t make it rape. Educate yourself on what rape is.

Jacob Klein
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Yeah I think Cian is right that there’s a little bit of historical bias going on. For example people give the founding fathers a pass for owning slaves because that was the time they lived in. Or the fact that women have been treated like shit in a lot of places for… well.. pretty much forever but we don’t frown on those societies as a whole because they’re “of their own time”. That doesn’t mean we can’t look back and say “yeah that was slavery” or “yeah that was totally rape”. But keeping it in context is important. And Cian,… Read more »
Ashton
Guest

Consensual sex isn’t rape…. and what (in the books) happened between Jaime and Cersei WAS CONSENSUAL. I suppose you guys just didn’t actually read the books for what they were, you bought into the 21st century rape-culture crap that basically says girls can make bad decisions, regret them- call it rape AFTER the fact and the man should do time in the slammer. It’s ridiculous.

Cian Gaffney
Guest

I agree with everything you said, I just wasn’t clear enough!
Just to be clear – yep, it’s rape. But Cersei wouldn’t have the perception modern women have on the subject, that’s all I’m saying. Judging be everything that happens afterwards, there’s no evidence to suggest she viewed it as an assault by Jaime.

Rochelle
Guest

That part, that because she let’s it go afterward, it is supposed to mean that her later actions indicate that in the moment she never thought it was against her will, is the part I take issue with. She’s allowed to let it go, move past it, forget it – but we shouldn’t all assume that it means she didn’t feel violated in that moment. But, I suppose we can agree to disagree on this point.

Rochelle
Guest

I do agree with everything you just said, Jacob!

QueenTitania
Guest

This was an awesome article. As the victim of spousal rape, I truly understand the points made here. often, those outside domestic violence question why its victims often stay – it’s because staying is sometimes safer. Also because the abuser is often also the comforter. sometimes I even questioned myself as to whether I had been raped when so often I just gave in and participated – it’s because saying ‘no’ is impossible and saying ‘yes’ energetically sometimes make the experience get over sooner.

Brian Puddin Jeffries
Guest
Brian Puddin Jeffries

I don’t understand how it’s different from the book? It was a rape seane in the book and it’s a rape seane on HBO.

benkz1
Guest
“The reason everyone is so uncomfortable with HBO making sure no one doubted this was a rape scene is because people don’t want to believe that partners and spouses would be so disrespectful as to selfishly interpret a partner’s “No” as a challenge instead of an edict.” Eh, some people are ‘uncomfortable’ because they don’t like the change from the book. Others are because rape is disturbing to them in general, so seeing it on TV is too. Others are because they somehow see this interpretation of a scene as a condonement for rape. Still more are because to see… Read more »
Marissa
Guest

what change from the book? very very little was changed from the book for this scene.

benkz1
Guest

It’s noted in the very same article above? The link to Martin’s response has someone asking why the change?

VL Vanderveer
Guest

Rochelle, EXCELLENT article! This needed to be said, and by a woman. What Jaime did was completely wrong and if the directors and Martin wanted it to be different, then it should have been filmed and written differently. Thank you, also, for telling women everywhere that “no” means NO – not later, not try harder, not convince me. We may not like Cersei, but even she doesn’t deserve something like this. NO ONE DOES, woman or man. The scene was just wrong and covering it up with ipso facto Cersei consenting by doing these things is ridiculous.

Ashton
Guest

Cersei wanted it, and sometimes we women DO say no and not mean NO. And in Cersei’s case- in the books at least, she’s not saying no because she doesn’t want to have sex- she’s saying no because she knows what she WANTS is immoral. That doesn’t make it non-consensual. And it’s not ‘ipso facto’ just because YOU don’t like it.

Ben Auron
Guest

This scene was wrong? The majority of the scenes in GoT are wrong. Killing, maiming, slavery, and mysogeny aplenty. I may not be a woman, but taking of a human life is way worse than rape. These “wrongs” are just part of the show. This scene just shows Jaime isn’t as noble as we all thought. At least, that’s how I understand it.

Marissa
Guest
what’s wrong about it is that people are saying it WASN’T RAPE. not in the books and not in the show when IT’S CLEARLY RAPE. that’s what’s wrong no one is saying that this is better or worse than any of the crimes committed on the show. what’s bad is that the viewers, the readers, and even the author don’t have appropriate understandings of consent and rape. if someone says no it means no regardless of the situation, relationship, or context. her no and her reasoning why was not respected in either the show or the book and many people… Read more »
benkz1
Guest
Ah, I think I see what I did not before. People are taking “it was consensual by the end” to mean it wasn’t rape by the director…whereas he specifically does state, “What was talked about was that it was not consensual as it began” Here he is saying: It was rape. Benioff describes the scene this way: “You see that Cersei is resisting this. She’s saying no, and he’s forcing himself on her. or. Benioff too here is coming out and saying: it was rape. You can say their reasoning for it become consensual is wrong, but they’re nor saying… Read more »
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